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Post by Deleted on Jan 1, 2016 12:15:53 GMT -7
he is not doing anything now that is sinful, i do not believe he is accessing porn, however i have been here many times and it never lasted. i do not have details of his 'plan' because thats his journey not mine- however, he is seeing a specialist counsellor . i cant stop feeling in chaos just because he isnt sinning 'right now.' is that supposed to make everything ok?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 1, 2016 12:38:57 GMT -7
What are your choices? You can worry and wait for him to fail again or you can pray and give control over to the Lord. I know my wife kept believing in me and what God was doing in me after many many failures. This is a process not a one time deliverance or quick fix. The fact you say this is his journey rather than "our" journey shows you are not working together as a team. I really don't know what else to say except I'm sorry this is so painful and I will pray for you.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 1, 2016 12:51:04 GMT -7
believe me this has not been a one-time fail thing, this has been 7 years of over and over. i handed over things to God very consciously and took the very hard road of forgiveness and believing God would restore and make up what the locusts had eaten. I changed from controlling to letting him take leadership back, over the family and over his own recovery.I believed in 'our journey' enough to give up my home, my friends,a and my work to follow him whereever God had inistry for him. what happened was a deception beyond all others. I dont blame God because it was my husbands choices. but now i know it is not 'our' journey, i did 'our journey' with complete understanding and acceptance and allowing him not to be perfect , but to come to me with his struggles and for us to fight it together. Honesty was all i asked for, not perfection. I wanted to know HIM, not to be presented with this fake persona who had no problems and no negative emotions. he chose not to share. he chose to make it one reality for me and another for him. I tried to be a team but he showed to be incapable of vulnerability which is why it has to be his journey now, no amount of co-ercion can make someone really be on side with you. The lack of team now was not for my lack of trying. I am tired of thinking i'm on a team only to find out my teammate is punching holes in the boat i'm paddling desparately , and telling me he didnt do it. I dont think you have any idea what severe gaslighting does to somebody's sanity, i nearly lost my mind this summer , the deception was so complete it was like living a psychological chiller and my daughter simply cannot go through this again either, but God has told me to stay. ..so to answer your question i dont have any choice. and yes, the team broke down big time, that is the whole problem
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Post by Deleted on Jan 1, 2016 13:09:01 GMT -7
Well vulnerability is crucial . Honesty is essential. The fact he isn't on here too tends to confirm your doubts of his sincerity. I remember as much as I feared hurting my wife I feared even more God's judgement for lying to and betraying my wife. Even God at some point says enough.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 1, 2016 18:40:06 GMT -7
Elle, I am sorry you are hurting so badly. I just want to remind you that you are a strong woman. I could not deal with all you have dealt with and remain sane. If you are sure God wants you to stay in your marriage, then He will provide you the strength needed and a way through to your own healing. Your husband needs to step up and prove himself...how? I have no idea. Keep clinging to God. He is your answer.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 2, 2016 10:31:33 GMT -7
Ellekay, Ive been reading through your thread. It's evident you are in great pain and have been through a lot. I want to encourage you that there is hope, no matter how dark it seems in the moment. My husband struggles with sex addiction - it progressed throughout his life from porn to acting out sexually with prostitutes. I discovered this 5 years ago and it was earth shattering to say the least. I have shared our story in another thread which you are free to read if you like. 5 years later we are in a good marriage, only by Gods grace, massive accountability, very hard work, and sticking with it even when things appear hopeless. Please don't get the idea that I am naive and believe my husband will never struggle or perhaps fall into the pit again. We have been through a relapse where he acted out with a prostitute approx 1 year into recovery. My eyes are always wide open and so should every wife's be. I share the depth of my husband's sin - because I want people to know how bad porn use can progress, and that no matter how far, how deep the sin, God is able to turn a complete, devastated mess into something good that brings Him glory. All that being said, nothing comes easy. I read a lot of valid pain and anger in your thread, but I don't see details of what specific steps your husband has taken to learn to be free from porn addiction. Is he in an accountability group? Is he getting counseling from a Christian counselor who specializes in sex addiction? Is there accountability software on all his devices so he is being held accountable when he falls into viewing porn? Is he accountable to you with his time and money?
You ask how trust can be rebuilt. It absolutely can - but not without a consistent, sincere action from your husband to rebuild it. Trust is not freely given to just anyone. It is built over time, consistently and without coercion. If that's not happening in your marriage, you cannot trust. Our SA counselor gave me good advice. Trust, but verify. My marriage will be a lifetime of verifying. It has to be - due to the intense damage that was done. To expect a wife to blindly trust the word of a husband who has shown evidence of lying again and again is insanity. Your husband needs to be providing you proof on a daily basis of his whereabouts, his computer, phones, devices, need to be open access to you with no resentment on his part. I agree with others on here - you need to be a united team fighting daily against this sin. That's a hard thing to do as a wife because it's painful when the husband is struggling or slips. You need to be able to process your emotions with someone, a counselor, or a group that is safe. There are phone support groups lead by therapists that are available if there's not a group in your area. Find one that works for you. Don't let the anger, bitterness, and hopelessness take over you. It can very easily do just that. Focus on setting boundaries with your husband that protect you and your child. Get help from a counselor who is experienced with sex addiction or addiction in general.
One more comment about men who claim that they have been completely, miraculously healed of sex addiction. Red flags fly up. Yes - God can do anything, but both my husband and and I have never heard of it. SA counsellors we have talked to have never seen it. They've had many clients who claim it, but the reality is far from that. Sex addiction/porn addiction sears the conscious and is inherently self focused and prideful. I tend to think if God just miraculously took it all away, the man would still be left with all his sinful pride, and self absorption. Just thinking about Paul's thorn in the flesh - which God left for him to deal with the rest of his life to keep Paul humble and relying on God instead of himself. Just my two cents.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 7, 2016 6:25:49 GMT -7
Elle, how are things going?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 17, 2016 3:22:35 GMT -7
Hi, Sorry guys, I blocked the site from myself for a while after feeling scared that you guys were judging me , or would judge me, for not being 'a team' and for being in this mess emotionally when he 'isnt doing anything wrong at the moment' . I'm glad I came back because the last few posts i missed have been incredibly supportive and understanding.
To answer the question: we have always had ridiculous amounts of internet security. Breaches have generally been when there has been new technology or computer/phone update and i have not been aware of every loophole possible until too late. Another breach was in buying a magazine which i clearly cannot control. So, security ok to a point, but i cant rely on it.
he signed up with a specialist in the area we have moved to. he has seen a specialist a few years ago aswell, did about 6 months fortnightly, thought he had done enough, relapsed a year later. he has done SAA and lied to the whole group. He has had accountability partners and lied to them. he has had 'deliverance' then let it back in. This time we went for couples counselling and they said they would not see us as a couple til his addiction was dealt with. So he saw one of their specialists alone . He didnt buy the book they recommended until they had suggested it 3 times and i also , in frustration, finally mentioned it. he has not read it as far as i know. On the 3rd session he was venting about me pulling away from him (fine to vent, he accepts the damage and is patient with me in person) the counsellor said i was 'still punishing him'. She also told him she felt it was fine to MB if he needed to. Even though he said that sobriety was no MB for every reason (neural pathways reasons, agreement with me reasons, and faith reasons) he said he already knew all the stuff she was telling him from years of recovery reading and counselling. (probably true) and they agreed there was no point him continuing as he had been clean almost 6 months now so therefore did not score as an addict on their little assessment. Now they are quite happy to move onto seeing us as a couple. (I don't think so) So, he has abandoned that recovery path but given her attitude towards me and MB I am glad he has abandoned it, even though it conflicts with my need to see him in active recovery.
He does appears to be deeply affected by me leaving him over the summer and the shock of losing his daughter also for that time, and the effect it has had on her and me up til present time. I do think that he had not experienced enough personal pain and now he has. He has said as much himself, that awful as it sounds, before only i went properly into Hell, and this time he did. I suspect that might be as much to do with it as the latest 'deliverance from oppressive spirits' (however, apparantly that deliverance involved demonic voices and all kinds of things, I wasnt there, he didnt remember it, I am told this by the two men who did it with him)
because of the first counsellors rrefusing to see us as a couple we had found a christian counsellor in november who we started seeing , as the day to day living together again was absolutely intolerable and we needed immediate help, couldnt wait years for him to go through his own stuff. She is nice, she understands the issues and the damage, and my husband finds it helpful to dissect his communication with me present. I expressed a concern about the dependence on me being part-therapist to him as it often feels, but the counsellor said we are one couple that it seems most helpful to see us together, as he gives his view of reality (i.e a good week , only a couple of arguments ) then I need to completely point out what really happened (we argued 75% of the very few times we were alone together and 100% of the time when the subject matter was significant)
This week i expressed my concern about him not being in a recovery of his own but i dont have any solution for it because the 'help' he has received has not helped before, and this latest was downright harmful! My husband has a better unerstanding of the harm done to me than the specialist did, and he knows i'm not punishing him. His fear is that he has damaged me too much for me to ever have joy again, or to ever be able to enjoy intimacy with him. me doing it for the sake of it , he says is worse than abstinance.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 17, 2016 6:02:05 GMT -7
I am truly sorry Ellekay if I made you feel judged. Sometimes communication on a forum isn't helpful in determining a person's emotional and spiritual condition. My wife too has been plagued by paranoid and deceiving thoughts that satan keeps stirring up. This is my fault. I need to be more reassuring and supportive to my wife at those times instead of getting angry and defensive. I also need to stay clean so I can honestly say I'm doing ok. Being a team means I need to realize the damage I have done and be compassionate and protective of my wife when the enemy attacks her. If we addicts could be on the other side of this addiction and feel what our spouses are feeling perhaps we would stop focusing on ourselves so much.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 17, 2016 7:46:27 GMT -7
Elle, I am glad you are back hon. I have been worried and praying for you.
If you ever feel like you are being judged, let me know. I will step in. If I ever make you feel that way and you aren't comfortable bringing it to my attention, you can contact Jonathan or mike. We work as a team and as family here. I am sorry if I did make you feel that way.
You have worked so hard at staying in your marriage. It's time that your husband steps up and shoulders the load and proves himself. Concentrate on healing yourself and healing your daughter. Fix your eyes on God.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 17, 2016 10:07:55 GMT -7
Amy actually I came back because I read back to a bit of my journal from TTF because i needed to make sense of something, and i read one of your posts in my journal.
When you say you dont know if you could go through what I have , and remain sane- thank you! That means a lot. I have been right on the edge.
Braveheart it was what you said , but my judgement is so impaired I don't honestly know if you said anything insensitively or not , so no bad feelings. All i know is that I am incredibly senstive - this comes from the amount of spiritual 'abuse' I have had over the years- sometimes by knowingly using spirituality to mask truth, sometimes unwittingly by very naive people with no understanding, sometimes by counsellors and church leaders who have rubbed salt into the wounds. I felt like you were saying I was stubbornly listening to satan because you picked up chaos in my emotions (and you know where that comes from). I felt as if I was going to be told I need to forgive and move on with a clean slate if I am to call myself Christian. (he isnt doing anything now). This is just how sensitive I am to 'spiritual judgment' bcause I have been told all sorts of things by christians, including that all my struggles come from a spirit of freemasonry in my family, nothing to do with being repeately betrayed and deceived by my husband! The stuff i have been through and the accusations on my faith have just been incredibly unhelpful and make me sensitive to the point of paranoid if I think an attack is coming.
I had a bad moment last night which has stayed with me today, basically i had started reading Stormie Omartian's book "Out of darkness", so far so good! I was reading something that would be encouraging, you would think? In the story she is recounting how someone left her roses every day , an admirer or stalker, anyway I suddenly remembered that this summer just gone, my husband had been giving me a rose every day or so, I didnt know how he was doing it because it was a single bud every day and I didnt know where he was getting them from and if he had bought them at once how they had stayed budded? It turned out he had found some way to treat them and he had carefully done it and stored them in the shed. he was writing in his journal how he wanted to win my heart back, with no response from me expected. (we were trying an agreed abstinance for the first time ever, to break his stronghold over fear of not getting sex) At first I felt neutral to these overtures (we were only about 3 months post-relapse) but after a little while I had started to quite like it, and look forward to my next surprise. I genuinely felt he was trying to win my heart back. Yesterday it dawned on me that while he was giving me those roses, he was actively watching p regularly. I knew it had happened during the phony 'abstinence' but I had forgotten about the roses.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 17, 2016 10:50:50 GMT -7
Elle I am sorry. My heart hurts with yours. Know that God is El Roi. He sees everything in us. He hurts for you also. If I had the money, I would come and give you a hug. God is our strength so lean on Him. He loves you.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 17, 2016 11:16:14 GMT -7
Hope22 I would be interested in reading your thread, please can you post me the link?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 17, 2016 11:27:04 GMT -7
ellekay again I just want to apologize for misreading your situation and being insensitive with my comments. I'm glad you are back.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 17, 2016 11:52:48 GMT -7
thats ok braveheart, by the way I like your quote on the side bit <<<<<. We lived in Scotland for the past 7 years (is that where the braveheart reference comes from?)we lived nestled into the Campsie hills. I loved my mountain. On the side of it were deep crevices carved into the hill. When we first moved there I commented that it looked like writing etched into the mountainside. After I was given spiritual sight I saw what it said- loud and clear- the letters carved into the hills, maybe since the great flood?! were YWH...Yahweh. i felt like God had carved his name into those hills just for me. That is one thing I was so sad to leave when I moved here in october to reconcile with my husband. I miss my hill that God wrote his name on just for me
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