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Post by Deleted on May 13, 2010 2:38:01 GMT -7
Hi everyone,
If you've read my earlier posts, you'll know that I'm pretty new to all this and just trying to find my way!
My husband has been in therapy about 4 months and attending SA group meetings for about 2 months. He has been a sex addict for 40 years. Sex addiction is always the "elephant" that's in the room with us. We talk about it but not nearly as much as I would like.
There have been occasions where I would ask him something and he would answer. I would then ask the same question in a different manner. He would respond with the same answer.....then add, "I don't lie anymore".
I would receive it but think to myself "no one changes a 40 year behavior just like that". I believe he has stopped lying to a point because of the relief revealing his problem brought him. Let's face it, it is a lot of work to lie and have to constantly be on your guard. But it's the little voice of reason that tells me to take everything in with a grain of salt.
Anyway, I have the suspicion that he has been "acting out" and am not sure how to handle it. I can search the house looking for porn or any other clues. But, if I find something, do I throw it in his face to show him how he's failed (something he already knows)? Do I not search the house....it makes me feel like a cop! If I don't find anything, do I keep quiet (I have no proof)? Or do I simply, just talk to him about my suspicion, re-verbalize my position on the subject, then let it alone?
I do believe that I am entitled to my suspicion and that it's justified.
Does anyone have any thoughts?
Thanks....everyone on the forum is very helpful and I do appreciate it!!!!
AllAlone
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Post by Deleted on May 13, 2010 3:19:37 GMT -7
Hi Allalone,
This is tough, and often different depending upon your situation. If your husband would try to keep in mind the fable "The Boy Who Cried Wolf," he will hopefully be patient with the time it will take to grow trust again. If you are not at a point that you trust his word, asking him is not likely to provide reassurance. If you then search and find something that he has not confessed to, you will have caught him in a lie. If you find nothing, it might mean that he told the truth, or just that you didn't find it/it is not on the property. On the other hand, following your instinct about acting out is wise. After my first discovery, i did not check at all. When I stumbled across a second incident, I checked, without mentioning it to him, off and on for a year. I don't remember the last time I checked. Your husband is not realistic to expect your trust to return quickly. It has been deeply wounded. Most people I have read, and I, myself, prefer honesty about failure than ignorance, which feels like more lies.
I guess I would boil it down to this. If searching and finding nothing would reassure you, go ahead, but if it would just leave you wondering if he's keeping it away from home, it may be counter-productive. Hopefully others will share other perspectives.
TruthSeeker
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Post by Deleted on May 13, 2010 3:28:53 GMT -7
This is something that only you can decide for yourself......... me, I make him aware that I have found something or know that he is acting out. Over the years I pretty much do take a lot of things with a grain a salt............. I have found that when I confront him with the porn I have found in my hands....... though, he "cant" lie........... so he is being held accountable for that moment......... I only confront my husband when I have the proof in my "hands" other wise you are simply choosing to live in your fear.............. this is not a path for the faint of heart or the weary.......... so save your battles for the real thing or you will wear yourself out and serve of no true purpose to your husbands possible recovery. Do not search unless you strongly feel that God is giving you that nudge to. It will take much time for you to be able to discern the difference between your fear and Gods truth. In time you will find that your fears will fade............. and your searches will lessen but always keep in mind the next time proof is found you will have to start the entire healing process all over again.......... If however you are feeling particularly fearful and you have no proof....... speak to your husband........... let him know that you are having an emotionally bad day and that you are scared................ thats all.......... you can do this in kindness................ and with your sincere sadness with out accustaion & anger and if he is accountable at all, he should understand and try to console you............. .... Hmm.? You say that you believe your suspicion is justified......... if you truly think that something is in the house. find it and deal with it.......... let him begin to learn & understand that not only is he accountable to you he is accountable to God....... and that God has "your" back & is watching out for you! God will always reveal un truths so he might as well get use to it now.............
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Post by Deleted on May 13, 2010 5:18:38 GMT -7
Hi Godsgirl,
I like this....."so save your battles for the real thing or you will wear yourself out and serve of no true purpose to your husbands possible recovery"
Thank you!!!!
allalone
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Post by Deleted on May 13, 2010 5:57:51 GMT -7
Have you stated what the consequences are for his acting out? Have you decided where your line will be drawn?
The thing about snooping/finding is that you then have to respond. I always ask myself, what will I do if I find something? My response becomes more important than what I actually find.
It is just like with little children. You warn them and warn them, and yell, but they just keep running over you until you put your foot down and send them to bed without dessert!
I separated from my husband--actually moved in to a little apartment with my three babies--- when I found that he would not leave his affair partner alone, after lying repeatedly about it.
Six months after, we reconciled and moved back in together. But I told him if he so much as sent her an email he would come home from work to find his stuff on the front lawn and the locks changed. I believe he knew I meant business. That was three years ago. I still feel if I found evidence of him talking to her I would kick him out.
He knows I mean business because I already proved I can live without him. I also proved that to myself. Actually, when you separate it feels great to have your own space, without the spiritual evil of sexual sin and lies in your home.
So now, dealing with the porn. I have not decided what my limit or consequences will be if I catch him, after I have said I won't allow it. So I have not been snooping for evidence. If I do lay down a serious consequence, I know I have to follow through. He does not respect me AT ALL unless I follow through. For him, it is not about words. Just like with stubborn little kids.
By the way, if my husband ever had another affair (including prostitutes, by the way), I would move out immediately. I won't go through that again. I want to prove to my daughters and myself that I am not a piece of garbage.
I also believe in grace, mercy and forgiveness. Things I would be glad to extend to my ex husband.
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Post by Deleted on May 13, 2010 6:48:27 GMT -7
Hi Babette,
You hit the nail on the head! I have NOT decided where the line will be drawn or what the consequences will be.
I truly believe that his addiction stems from his child abuse. In addition to all the negative emotions and feelings from the abuse, I can't deny that as a child, he "felt" something "good" in the chemical reactions of the brain. Not having parents emotionally there to show him what real love is, I believe he associated sex with love. I think he has spent his entire life seeking the love he didn't get from his parents. And to him, that meant sex. So, he's been "acting out" for 40 years!
That type of ingrained thinking just doesn't disappear with the flip of a switch. I don't know if you've heard of the BAR cycle, but it stands for belief, action and results. Results are based on the actions that are based on the beliefs. So until he can change his way of thinking (his beliefs), his actions will remain the same with the same results as well. (Remember, he's been doing this for 40 years!)
As I said, I have not decided where the line will be drawn or what the consequences will be. For two reasons. First, if I state a consequence to his behavior....I have to follow through with that consequence. Second, how can I state the acceptable limit (if any) when I know it will be almost impossible for him to achieve at this point. To me it feels like I would be a setting him up for failure.
No, it's not acceptable behavior to make masturbation and prostitutes part of our life. And maybe I'm wrong (someone please tell me) but I can't bury my head in the sand and say that because he's in therapy, he won't do it. He does know it's wrong (otherwise he wouldn't have so much shame and guilt), but knowing the behavior is wrong and abstaining from it completely contradicts the very nature of addiction! At least in this early phase of his recovery.
So if I say ....prostitutes are out but masturbation is OK....I feel like I'm just choosing the lesser of two evils. Even when I feel that both behaviors are harmful to our marriage.
Sure I can say ....prostitutes are definitely out and we'll have to work on the masturbation. But again, at such an early stage of recovery, I don't know if he has the "beliefs" that will stop the "actions" and "results". I'm willing to bet he's not there yet.
For the most part, he still views his addiction as a weakness in himself. He's having a hard time seeing the correlation between the sexual abuse and his actions today. Also, in his mind, his parents are saints! He can't accept the fact that they are human and make mistakes let alone believe they made any mistakes while he was growing up. He looks at their lack of affection as there being something wrong with him...that he wasn't worthy of love.
There's a lot more pain in store for him. He'll have to realize his parents weren't perfect and take them down from their pedestals. Then he will have the whole process of forgiveness to deal with.
His issues go way beyond me. The unfortunate part is that I am the one that has to deal with this mess created by his family.
I may be crazy (and again, please let me know!) but I don't see how our marriage and family can ever be OK until he's OK! Does that make sense? Am I way off base with this one?
Right now, I feel the only line I can draw is that he must continue therapy and group meetings. If he does not continue to work on making himself better, then I can't stick around.
I'm thinking that for now, I must leave the "searching/snooping" alone.
Please friends, respond with your thoughts. They are immensely helpful!
Blessings to you all,
All Alone
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Post by Deleted on May 13, 2010 7:11:57 GMT -7
Dear Allalone,
Trust your gut. If your instinct is telling you there is something going on, chances are you are correct.
As women, we pick up on subtle clues and assemble them much more easily than they do.
You deserve to live in a porn free home. You deserve to live your life free of the effects of pornography. Search. Ask. Confront. Your trust has been destroyed. He has to understand that and if he sincerely wishes to restore the relationship, he must do whatever you require to restore the trust. You are absolutely correct when you say: " ...he must continue therapy and group meetings. If he does not continue to work on making himself better, then I can't stick around." Absolutely correct!!!!
My best, DW
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Post by Deleted on May 13, 2010 8:36:35 GMT -7
I just read the book, The Porn Trap, which is not christian. It helps a bit to see what the secular advice is for people trying to rid their lives of porn. In the recovery section of the book, they state how some people 'ween' themselves off hardcore porn to soft, then to none. Like smokers. That probably would not fly in the Christian world of therapy, but I think it could be a techinique that works well for some personality types. Especially if porn has been a ritual for so long.
I think there are lots of ways addicts 'kick'. Maybe it is important for some people to feel success because they are decreasing their use. "I masterbate but I don't go to prostitutes anymore, so I know I am doing better". And so on, with the goal of sobriety eventually.
I would point out that separation can be very therapeutic, and it does not mean you will divorce. Some people separate for an agreed amount of time, work on their issues separately and together. You would then decide if he is well enough to continue the marriage. I think this works with people who are humble and want to get clean.
I don't think it would work if you have a charmer who snakes out of responsibility, doesn't see porn as all that bad, etc.
When I separated from my husband I told him I wanted to keep our family together, and that I would like to go to therapy and that I would do all I could to make our marriage work. I think that is quite a bit different than cussing someone out, leaving, hitting the singles bars and continuing on in rage.
Separation also released me from snooping, since he had full freedom to do anything. He came back after six months of introspection. I think that just as a man has to search his heart and mind to ask a woman to marry him, he also must do that when it is up to him to keep the marriage together.
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Post by Deleted on May 13, 2010 10:40:31 GMT -7
Hi Babette, You hit the nail on the head! I have NOT decided where the line will be drawn or what the consequences will be. As I said, I have not decided where the line will be drawn or what the consequences will be. For two reasons. First, if I state a consequence to his behavior....I have to follow through with that consequence. Second, how can I state the acceptable limit (if any) when I know it will be almost impossible for him to achieve at this point. To me it feels like I would be a setting him up for failure. Right now, I feel the only line I can draw is that he must continue therapy and group meetings. If he does not continue to work on making himself better, then I can't stick around. I'm thinking that for now, I must leave the "searching/snooping" alone. Please friends, respond with your thoughts. They are immensely helpful! Blessings to you all, All Alone I hear ya.........on the consequence thing........... I had told my husband that I would divorce him the next time I found porn in the house......... that was about a year ago and guess what......... I found it a few weeks ago.......... :-( Did I leave him...........? No........ but I did take every single item of mine out of our bedroom and set up my own room down the hall. I slept in there for a few days...... my teens think I did it just because I wanted my own clutter free space :-) They know that I get upset with him at times though....... they just done know "why" Yes, be careful of verbally giving him consequences that you may not be ready to stand by or commit to. My husband also has severe ADHD........ I believe "it" has alot to do with his addiction and impulsive behavior. Mine believes that since he no longer sees prostitues and only slips and watches porn sometimes that he is getting better.............. and perhaps he is right in some aspects.......... my husband has never gone to counceling or anything.............. and he & I have done this journey alone with only God as our witness. But the porn it hurts like hell too........... especially to me since he only watches porn with women of another race........... dang............ its painful and it rips open all of the old wounds! Sorry.......... just venting!
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Post by Deleted on May 15, 2010 2:20:12 GMT -7
Hi Allalone
If I may say something..I've been in your position in the past..after a lengthy battle with my husbands porn and lies to cover it..he had come clean and admitted to it...so good so far, but after a short while I too had "this feeling" a still small voice??? that he had checked out porn again. I straight away brought this to GODS attention and this was his his reply to me - Let it alone jo for you will not have evidence BUT I WILL TELL YOU THE PROPER TIME. and HE did..3 weeks later while I was in and out of sleep with my husband right near me.. I clearly hear Holy Spirit say..HE is on porn sites right now when you get up you will be able to check and see. so,I went back to sleep!! I then had a dream that also confirmed this truth..and in the morning it was all there! Understand this...You have Holy Spirit -the Spirit of TRUTH in you right? You asked your husband a question that has to do with your covenant contract with God. If your husband tells you something contrary to what God has told you GOD WILL REVEAL IT..WHY?? Because our Heavenly Father will not be made to be a liar..TRUST HIM.. Tell Jesus what you suspect and ask Him reveal the Truth to you. Heavenly Father Do for my sister what you did for me! and have her walk close to you to hear your voice do not let her walk in deception..in Jesus's mighty name I'm asking.. Thank you Father God!
Trust Him allalone
Joanne
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Post by Deleted on May 17, 2010 5:14:58 GMT -7
Hi Allalone If I may say something..I've been in your position in the past..after a lengthy battle with my husbands porn and lies to cover it..he had come clean and admitted to it...so good so far, but after a short while I too had "this feeling" a still small voice??? that he had checked out porn again. I straight away brought this to GODS attention and this was his his reply to me - Let it alone jo for you will not have evidence BUT I WILL TELL YOU THE PROPER TIME. and HE did..3 weeks later while I was in and out of sleep with my husband right near me.. I clearly hear Holy Spirit say..HE is on porn sites right now when you get up you will be able to check and see. so,I went back to sleep!! I then had a dream that also confirmed this truth..and in the morning it was all there! Understand this...You have Holy Spirit -the Spirit of TRUTH in you right? You asked your husband a question that has to do with your covenant contract with God. If your husband tells you something contrary to what God has told you GOD WILL REVEAL IT..WHY?? Because our Heavenly Father will not be made to be a liar..TRUST HIM.. Tell Jesus what you suspect and ask Him reveal the Truth to you. Heavenly Father Do for my sister what you did for me! and have her walk close to you to hear your voice do not let her walk in deception..in Jesus's mighty name I'm asking.. Thank you Father God! Trust Him allalone Joanne
God has come to me several times in my dreams and told me when & where to look .............. that is how I found out about his addiction to begin with!
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