Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 3, 2011 5:08:54 GMT -7
"Hi Chris, who is it not constructive for? You or she? If it is not constructive for her, how do you know it is not constructive for her? What is good for her? What does she need?"
I think I evaded the question raised here.
It was my opinion that it was not constructive to go over it again and again as you cannot move forward.
By talking more and more, surely this is why she then visualises what I did.
I do need to know what is good for her and understand better what her needs are...
It probably sounds selfish, but much of my focus has been on me to stop the pattern of behaviour and then I have been looking at removing any triggers from my wife that will upset her...and then I have been looking at her emotional well being...
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 3, 2011 5:16:25 GMT -7
[user=337]truthseeker[/user] wrote:
You raise an interesting point and the basis of Christianity is the forgiveness we gained from the sacrifice God made in allowing his only Son to be crucified to allow us forgiveness and eternal salvation.
It has been a huge motivating force for me to seek forgiveness and an emotional release to feel it has been granted.
If in seeking forgiveness it was an impossible dream I am certain I would have given up weeks ago.
My wife commented that she felt I would make someone a wonderful husband but she feels unable to reconcile what I did with her perceptions and beliefs of who I am. So would rather I leave.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 4, 2011 3:01:30 GMT -7
Chris,
She cannot move forward until she has completely processed the betrayal. You cannot and MUST NOT try to accelerate this process or force her to heal on your time schedule. THIS WILL TAKE YEARS TO HEAL.
This mess took years to create. Why do you think it can be healed/cured/forgiven in months?
Please see: www.blazinggrace.org/cms/bg/brokenmarriage
You cannot "fix" her and I find it very curious that you are or have been "looking at her emotional well being..."
It almost sounds as if your wife is a case study, not the woman you promised to love, honor and cherish until death do you part.
Rest assured, you cannot bury this and think that it will go away. You have to do the hard work. Slog through the past and sort out why you did what you did. Your wife has to work through this in her own way in her own time.
Best, DW
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 6, 2011 10:32:17 GMT -7
Hi DW,
I do not assume anything.
I place a huge amount of my confidence into my faith.
It is not by faith alone that my wife shall be healed. It needs consistent action from me...and this is also faith based to stay free from lust and all the associated temptations that led to my downfall in the first place.
In some ways it has exposed the difference in man and woman in this case. I have reacted quickly and changed a long term pattern and steered away from all that is wrongful. My wife has only recently discovered all that is wrongful and this is really raw. It will take time for her to come to terms with what we had being destroyed by my actions and to really determine if she can ever trust me again, let alone have deep seated love for me. Will I betray her again and cause more hurt?
The saddest thing is that I dearly love her and she does not know to believe it or not...that is how it seems.
I know I was so very wrong...yet all I want is to find the times which were so very good and the best...and then emulate them.
Time is a healer...but she has forgiven me, but I do not at this point believe she wants to reconcile with me. The loss of trust and hurt is very deep indeed.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 7, 2011 4:00:51 GMT -7
Chris, Let me sum up your post simply, directly, unequivocally:
"Words are not enough. It's up to you build a new marriage based on DEEDS, not words or empty promises."
Is that what you were trying to say? Your post to me uses tortured language. No one speaks like that. I think you are saying what it is you think you have to say. Because of the tortured way you said it, I'm not sure you believe it in your heart, yet.
And I suggest to you that THERE IS NO DIFFERENCE BETWEEN A MAN AND A WOMAN WHO HAS BEEN BETRAYED. Your wife is not, as you suggest, "acting like a woman." She is acting like a PERSON who has been betrayed. Don't try to blame this on a Mars-Venus difference.
If the roles had been reversed, how would you be feeling and acting? Is it possible for you to imagine?
I again direct your attention to this piece:
www.blazinggrace.org/cms/bg/brokenmarriage
Finally, on "finding the best of times and emulating them," I don't think that will be at all helpful. You cannot go back, you have to go forward and make a new marriage. Returning to a spot where you once shared a wonderfully romantic dinner will not return her to the emotional state she enjoyed at that time. Every memory she has of the times you spent together is now tainted. You have to move forward with something new. You cannot return to what was, because it is no more.
Best, DW
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 8, 2011 14:44:27 GMT -7
Hi. I would encourage you to have your wife join us, Im a wife of a recovering addict and I think she would benefit from knowing there are other women struggling like she is. Im sorry I cannot contribute to this post, but I feel for her.
Jules.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 9, 2011 9:35:23 GMT -7
Chris, Let me sum up your post simply, directly, unequivocally: "Words are not enough. It's up to you build a new marriage based on DEEDS, not words or empty promises." Is that what you were trying to say? Your post to me uses tortured language. No one speaks like that. I think you are saying what it is you think you have to say. Because of the tortured way you said it, I'm not sure you believe it in your heart, yet. And I suggest to you that THERE IS NO DIFFERENCE BETWEEN A MAN AND A WOMAN WHO HAS BEEN BETRAYED. Your wife is not, as you suggest, "acting like a woman." She is acting like a PERSON who has been betrayed. Don't try to blame this on a Mars-Venus difference. If the roles had been reversed, how would you be feeling and acting? Is it possible for you to imagine? I again direct your attention to this piece: www.blazinggrace.org/cms/bg/brokenmarriageFinally, on "finding the best of times and emulating them," I don't think that will be at all helpful. You cannot go back, you have to go forward and make a new marriage. Returning to a spot where you once shared a wonderfully romantic dinner will not return her to the emotional state she enjoyed at that time. Every memory she has of the times you spent together is now tainted. You have to move forward with something new. You cannot return to what was, because it is no more. Best, DW As usual, brilliantly put DW!Especially this part "Words are not enough. It's up to you build a new marriage based on DEEDS, not words or empty promises." How are you getting on with that Chris?
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 10, 2011 3:52:40 GMT -7
[user=42104]Devastated Wife[/user] wrote:
Hi DW,
I am very good with words and can talk for England! However the deeds side is as you say the proof and delivers what I say.
Thus far, I have been demonstrably free from the addictive traits that caused so much damage to my marriage.
I have also complied with the requests to stop a business deal that would have taken me overseas and was dealing with people who were not particularly decent.
Other requests have been met in so far as possible.
Then my wife said she was going to make the list of things to comply with so difficult it would be impossible to do!
It felt like I was being set up to fail.
She does a part time job and I had an interview for a new job that came up on her work day. I cancelled the interview despite knowing that on this day she could have had two of the children with her as she has permission for this.
Wherever I look she is seeking to express her anger and state how little I have done...
Whenever i point out how much I have done I get berated for the errors I made in the past.
I meet my Vicar roughly once a week and am slowly working through the setting captives free course.
I seek a new marriage for sure...and to have new rules to ensure our happiness within the boundaries of this.
At the moment...it is very stressed at home and unfair for the children to hear the distress in my wife's dialogue.
I have read the link you kindly added and think it covers both sides really well.
In fact I have read it several times so it really register's.
You say I use tortured language. I think it the language of desperation both at the cause and effect of my actions and my deep seated desire to work through this and find the solutions that will allow her to heal over time.
For sure, I do not want to lose her.
In terms of "finding the best of times and emulating them" My motivation in saying this is to rebuild with a "new" marriage and aiming for what you know is best.
Surely, setting your sights high is right?
Perhaps the biggest hurdle is that she does not believe this is a new me. I lied for years and so this is a core issue now. Despite all I do, this issue caused a lot of hurt and does not go away.
I have often put myself in the shoes of my wife to try and get a small insight to the deep feeling of hurt. I have not managed to achieve even a percentage of how she feels.
My feelings of remorse do not touch on how she must feel.
Out of interest...how do you know you have been forgiven?
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 10, 2011 4:07:42 GMT -7
Forgiveness will take YEARS, after all the bitterness and pain has come out and she has reason to trust you again. Allow me to restate that:
Unless and until she has dealt with the pain of betrayal, let it all come out, the good, bad and ugly......
And unless and until she trusts you again.........
Forgiveness is too much to ask.
She cannot, will not and MUST NOT be expected to heal on your time schedule.
Best, DW
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 10, 2011 4:19:27 GMT -7
[user=8265]jjules[/user] wrote:
Thank you Jules....
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 10, 2011 4:22:35 GMT -7
Thank you DW.....
Do you think the healing is best done in the marriage or if it is better to separate for a time and for her to heal on her own terms without me being around like a catalyst of a reminder..
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 10, 2011 11:36:47 GMT -7
UKChris;
"Perhaps the biggest hurdle is that she does not believe this is a new me. I lied for years and so this is a core issue now. Despite all I do, this issue caused a lot of hurt and does not go away."
UKChris: Who is it a hurdle for? You or she? If it is for you, how can you solve your problem? If it is for her, leave it to her!!!
"I have often put myself in the shoes of my wife to try and get a small insight to the deep feeling of hurt. I have not managed to achieve even a percentage of how she feels."
How do you know that?
"My feelings of remorse do not touch on how she must feel."
How do you know that? What do you want to achieve by putting yourself in her shoes? How will that change you? How can you become a new creation by putting yourself in her shoes? Where is that solution recommended? Trying hard to become another person with own efforts? Trying to change yourself? I don't believe in that.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 10, 2011 11:38:37 GMT -7
"She cannot, will not and MUST NOT be expected to heal on your time schedule." I think you're right.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 10, 2011 21:12:22 GMT -7
As far as I can see, the issues are not so much about alcoholism, sex, drugs as it is about the heart of the human being? I think it is most of all something that is inside the human being?
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 12, 2011 4:04:22 GMT -7
Hi Chris,
I believe that is a question only you and your wife can answer. Early on in my recovery I would have been better off to have been separated from him. I flew into a rage at the very sight of him. He didn't even have to open his mouth. I'm not sure that was productive to my healing. Conversely, if we'd separated, I don't think I would have gone back to him.
Whether you stay or separate, you must make time to talk, discuss the addiction, discuss your progress, and give your wife the opportunity to ask questions and vent. And yes, this may be THE ONLY TOPIC of conversation for a long time. Her world has been destroyed. It's all she can think about. She has a lot to process. She cannot be expected to hold her thoughts or questions until next Tuesday at 4 PM when you've slotted a time to discuss this. She has to be free to discuss whenever she feels the need to do so.
Best, DW
|
|