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Post by Deleted on Nov 11, 2010 4:49:39 GMT -7
Hi,
It's my first time on these forums, so some introduction first. I'm UK-based, have been a Christian for 25 years or so, involved in church ministry of various kinds. To make a long story short, I discovered masturbation when I was about 15 or so and found a porn magazine on the ground on my way home from school. I bought a few magazines in my teenage years but nothing more. I have struggled with masturbation on and off ever since. I confessed it to my wife before we were married, and then had to confess to continuing to struggle with it a year or so after we married. I never mentioned it to her again.
The major problem began when we got internet access, and one day I accidentally stumbled across a porn site. I looked and masturbated, felt disgusted with myself and vowed never to look again. I stayed away for a while – maybe even a few months – but of course came back. I fell into an established pattern of vowing never to look at porn again, holding out for weeks or months at a time (though I was still regularly masturbating in the meantime), then giving into temptation and spending hours on the net (always when I was alone in the house, and usually when my wife was away visiting her parents), looking at more and more explicit stuff each time I went on there, masturbating, and then feeling overwhelmed by shame and guilt afterwards. This continued on and off for probably around ten years or so. I don't think I thought I would ever overcome it – I just resigned myself to the fact that I would always live with this terrible secret. I also somehow convinced myself that I could be a Christian and lead this double life with impunity. How our sin blinds us.
Anyway, my marriage was in tatters (though I refused to admit it), mainly because I had become so terribly selfish, prideful and emotionally withdrawn. Little did I know, but my wife had spoken to my pastor saying that she didn't know what was wrong with me and would he please meet up with me and do some digging. This was in February this year. Before he had chance to meet up with me, I searched the internet in desperation one day, came across the Setting Captives Free site and signed up for their 60-day Way of Purity course. My assigned mentor urged me to confess first to my pastor and then to my wife. I resisted strongly, but within days I confessed to my pastor and a couple of days later to my wife.
I honestly believed that my wife was going to kick me out and my life as I knew it would end. And I knew this was what I deserved. To my amazement, my wife forgave me and showed me nothing but love and acceptance. She said she was just relieved to know what had been wrong all this time. I can only say that I experienced the grace of God in a way I had never previously thought possible. We spent some time with our pastor and his wife, and also with some other godly friends who were able to counsel us and pray with us.
To say that our marriage has undergone a transformation this year would be a massive understatement. There has been an openness and honesty between us that wasn't even there when we first married. I can't begin to describe how wonderful it's been to no longer be living under a cloud of guilt and shame, and I am so thankful to God for His deliverance. Our sex life has also been unbelievable this year – I think for the first time in 17 years, sex has become a wonderful expression of love and sharing rather than a selfish act of self-gratification.
I still have my struggles, and that's particularly what I want to ask for help on. A month or so ago, after months of purity (I confessed to my wife in February and had been pure since then), I suddenly found myself massively tempted to masturbate. It was a time when we had unable to make love for ten days or so (due to my wife's period, tiredness, etc.). To be honest, during the previous few months I hadn't really had much of a problem with temptation, and I thought I had the problem licked. But then temptation hit me like a steam train; I couldn't believe how overpoweringly strong it was and how weak I felt. My mind was awash with impure thoughts – images I had put out of my mind for months came flooding back. I couldn't sleep at night. I was even tempted to go back to looking at porn – after all the damage it had done to me and my family, it seems unbelievable to think that I came so close to returning to it. Thank God, I shared my struggles with my wife, and although she at first found it a little hard to deal with, she was ultimately very understanding and we were able to talk and pray together and I came through it without giving in.
Since that time around a month and a half ago, I've had a couple of other periods where I've been beset with temptation. They tend to happen around the times of my wife's period or other times when she is perhaps tired and a little irritable, and I begin to feel emotionally rejected. I know she isn't rejecting me – at most it's a hormonal issue that she can't control – but it feels like rejection and I think that's one of the things that pushes me towards acting out. Again, I've managed to resist each time, but each time it's been an incredibly draining experience and I've felt pretty wiped out by it.
My mentor at Setting Captives Free, who I've kept in touch with, says that it's normal to still struggle with temptation, and that though it may get easier over time, it's probably something we'll have to live with until we get to heaven. He's right, of course, and so I'm not asking so much about how to reduce temptation. What I'm really interested to know can be summed up in two questions:
(1) How often do others of you recovering from sexual sin struggle with major temptation of this kind?
(2) Does anyone have any suggested strategies as to how to resist when temptation strikes? I'm not really interested in elastic-band-on-the-wrist type techniques, which seem pretty shallow to me. Just looking for real advice from real guys who are walking or have walked this same journey. There is no way I ever want to go back to where I was, but lust is so incredibly powerful and at times I feel so weak and am honestly scared that I might give in at a weak moment.
For info, I am committed to being accountable to a guy in my church (he's the guy from the couple I mentioned earlier who prayed with us). He's a fantastic guy, and we meet up and talk about how I'm doing from time to time and he has permission to ask me whatever he wants at any time. But it's not the type of relationship where I can phone him up all the time about my daily struggles. And I don't want to be that dependent on another person. There has to be a way that I can get sufficiently strong in my own faith and reliance on God that I can face this thing down and not come so close to the edge when faced with temptation.
Thanks in advance for any advice.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 11, 2010 13:49:10 GMT -7
Welcome, L2L! Thanks for the history and for the experience, strength and hope.
I expect we're all pretty different in how often we experience temptation, and in what form that temptation takes. I rarely have the sort of experience you describe, but I'm not young and some of that may be due to sexual issues not closely related to my addictive behavior. It's hard to generalize from a small data set, but maybe a couple of times a year, sometimes more, sometimes less?
My usual responses to temptation - including much milder temptation than what you describe - include
- Getting on the phone and calling other addicts.
- Going to more meetings, either face-to-face or online.
- Stepping back to watch the feeling itself. What am I feeling? What triggered that feeling? What's the feeling really about? Can I feel whatever I need to feel and then let the feeling go? Opening up space between myself and my feelings and trying to understand what they are really about is pretty important to me.
- Working with my counselor about my feelings and journaling about them is also important to me. I process a lot by writing.
- In the immediate moment, it's important to me not to fight, but instead to step aside from the rush of desire and to let it pass. I'll pray, reminding myself of my commitment to recovery and of my incredible gratitude for the new life I've been granted, reminding myself of my powerlessness over my addiction, turning the desire over to Christ so that He may deal with it as He wills, and trying to discern what I am being called to do and to do it. Stepping aside, expressing gratitude, and surrendering and turning over is a very important process for me.
- There are also meditation practices that are important to me.
There's probably more, but those are the basics. I would say that for me, this package is working, though my recovery has included slips.
Several of those techniques involve other people. I think that's good and necessary. Strength has never worked for me. I think, as someone once said, that strength is made perfect in weakness. I also want to question the idea that there has to be a way to do it without other people. Addiction, especially this addiction, is all about isolation; but recovery can't be. I have to learn to be with other people, to trust others, to share with others. It's part of the new life I'm being granted. And as the old saying goes, unus Christianus, nullus Christianus.
Just how it is working for me.
Tim M.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 14, 2010 21:11:56 GMT -7
Hi Tim,
Thanks so much for your thoughtful response, and sorry I haven't got around to replying sooner. I've had a busy few days.
I'm especially interested in a couple of things you said:
I realise this is inevitably something that is very personal to each individual, but I wonder if you can give me any more insight into how, in practical terms, you manage to step back and begin to get some perspective on what your feelings are really about? Feelings are notoriously deceptive...
I recognise the sense of what you are saying. As you said later, God's strength is made perfect in weakness, and key to my own freedom was finally coming to the point of recognising that I was in a hopeless mess and utterly powerless to do anything about it. But the question is – and I think this is the absolute heart of the issue for me – how do I manage not to fight without giving into temptation? When strong temptation comes, it feels like if I don't fight with everything I have (including praying and calling out to God), there's no way I'll be able to resist; so not fighting sounds like giving in and being overwhelmed by temptation. Please understand, I'm not disagreeing with what you say – I think you're 100% right – I just need to find that place where I learn not to fight in my own strength.
I'd be interested if there's any more light you can shed on this.
Finally, looking back over my post, I realise that what I said about not depending on other people sounds very haughty and proud. It doesn't really get across what I wanted to say. I realise that I need people, and that isolation is one of the most dangerous places I can be in. Let me try to say it another way: I don't want to always feel that I am so on the edge of temptation and sin that the only way for me to stay pure is to be constantly dependent on groups, daily conversations with other sexual sinners, etc. Taking the example of an alcoholic, he or she might succeed in being dry (at least for a period) by relying on others to keep him or her away from the juice, but unless the underlying addiction is dealt with, he or she will always remain an alcoholic and has never really overcome the addiction. They are managing it and dealing with the symptoms rather than having addressed the underlying cause. While I realise that overcoming this kind of sin is a journey rather than an overnight thing, I believe that God wants me to be truly free from, not just having to manage it on a daily basis. I hope I've managed to explain that a little bit more clearly.
Thanks again for taking the time to share – I really appreciate it.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 23, 2010 4:08:22 GMT -7
Ah, and I've been busy as well. Let me see how much I can say in response to your questions. Of course, all this will be based on my experience, and may not apply to anybody else.
You ask about understanding my feelings. That's not an easy process for me. Tools I use have included meditation, journaling, sharing with others, and right now close to 6 years of counseling. At the start of my time working with a therapist, he would stop me and ask me to close my eyes and tell him what I was feeling. My instinct was always to think, "How would I know? I've had to sit and feel things in my body and learn to connect them with emotional states. I've had to relive events from my past and events from the present, trying to describe my feelings, trying to connect present reactivity with past fears, trying to keep going a little deeper each time. I've had to learn to greet fear with pleasure. "Ah, my teacher! Welcome! What is it I'm running from now? What can I feel and begin to be free from today?"
There's no magic formula, but really feeling, really writing, really sharing with others, and accepting that it's not going to be the work of a month or a year or 10 years is really important.
You ask about not fighting. A lot of what I can say has to be metaphorical. I've learned, as the Borg teach us, that resistance is futile. I have to react to temptation by turning it over to God and then letting it go, really trusting God to handle His responsibilities rightly. There is really a very physical sense of stepping out of the way and saying, "Ah, Christ, this one is for you. I really want to do what You would have me do. I can't do that unless You take care of this issue. That's not my task any longer. I'll try to follow You whatever Your decision on that may be. But I hope You'll make it possible for me to do that well." Then try to determine what my next task as a servant of God is to do, and set about doing that next right thing.
Another tool for me is working more psychologically. "Wow. Sudden temptation. [iInteresting.[/i] Where did that come from? What am I afraid of? What am I holding on to that I need to let go of? What am I afraid to do or resisting doing that I need to start now? What's this really about. Sometimes that understanding points the next right direction very clearly.
And you know, sometimes it's important to accept that I can't do it alone and that I need to pick up the phone or get to a meeting, either face-to-face or online.
You ask about meditation. I've been eldered before for not adequately respecting the Evangelical Christian character of this forum, a problem whose seriousness grows as the number of voices here declines. A lot of my meditation practice has roots outside Christianity (though not opposed to Christianity), so let me just try to point without offering distracting detail. Mindfulness meditation, which is aimed at living in the present and accepting and knowing what I experience, has been important for me in coming to terms with my body and in exploring my feelings. Google mindfulness meditation or vipassana if you want to see more. Lovingkindness meditation has also been useful to me in letting go of anger and isolation and reactivity. Finally, Tsultrim Allione teaches a process of imaginative visualization that I've found very helpful; but that may only be me.
Finally, on haughtiness, I don't see that in you. But I do think that working with others in recovery, as in the faith, is critical. I sort of turn your image of the alcoholic around backwards. I can stay sober for a while by being strong alone. But that can't last forever. If I want to get to lasting sobriety, I need to start breaking down the dividing walls that separate me from other people, walls that in the end keep me in isolation and addiction, and I have to pursue my recovery in community.
Just how it seems to me, of course.
Tim M.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 24, 2010 5:02:30 GMT -7
Hi Tim,
Thanks so much for your thoughtful reply. by the way, did anyone ever tell you you write really well?
I really liked what you said about saying to Jesus, "Ah, Christ, this one is for you. I really want to do what You would have me do. I can't do that unless You take care of this issue. That's not my task any longer. I'll try to follow You whatever Your decision on that may be. But I hope You'll make it possible for me to do that well." That's really helpful. Also thinking about psychologically.
You made reference to the declining number of voices on this site. I came to this forum because I found some of the material on the site really helpful, so it was a bit of a disappointment to see that the interaction has tailed off in recent times. Any idea why this is?
I had a bit of an epiphany this morning. I've been feeling increasingly edgy and having the urge to act out over the past couple of days. As I said before, this typically happens when I haven't been able to be intimate with my wife for a few days. Whenever we can't be intimate – be it through making love or just generally showing affection – I start to experience feelings of rejection. It's not rational, because I know that my wife loves me beyond what is reasonable – she's proved that to me beyond doubt this year. But the feelings are still there. So anyway, I was lying in bed this morning after a bit of a difficult night, and I had this realisation that what causes me to have the urge to act out is not any kind of burning physical desire or need – rather, it's the feelings of rejection. The acting out is just a way of coping with those feelings. I know this sounds really obvious, but it really was one of those moments when a light bulb came on. Reading back over previous posts in this thread, I realise that I had even managed to make a connection between feeling rejecting and feeling the urge to act out, but only today did the penny drop as to one being the cause of the other.
This still leaves me with the massive question of why I feel rejected in this way, and more importantly how I can be healed of this. But it feels good to have moved another step closer to understanding what's going on under the surface.
Thanks again for sharing.
L2L
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teetop
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Post by teetop on Jul 12, 2016 8:33:52 GMT -7
Wow, what a testimony!
Secrecy is a killer for our addiction and one we should take note of when it rears its ugly head in our thoughts.
It is nothing more than hiding behind closed doors.
Every time I attempted to keep a secret about my feelings or actions, I had already left God's presence and was trying to hide my sin. And to maintain that sin I find I've got to sin again by lying about it.
I also suspect that most of the time guilt and shame comes into play; warning us we have broken God's laws.
And each time we ignore those prompts from God we are sinning; we are hardening our heart towards God.
(Then we wonder why the temptations keep coming back more and more.)
And it gets harder and harder to fight back against the act/sin.
Like Paul's thorn, once we ignore the prompting of the Spirit about our sin and don't nip it in the bud, the temptation comes more frequently. Then we wonder why we are so easily triggered to act out in that same direction. And one other side point I'd like to make: We cry out to God to take the desire/lust from us and expect to be free from them. Then wondering why God has not answered our prayers about it. And here is where I think God has already given us our answer.
Jas 1:2 Consider it all joy, my brethren, when you encounter various trials,
Jas 1:3 knowing that the testing of your faith produces endurance.
Jas 1:4 And let endurance have its perfect result, so that you may be perfect and complete, lacking in nothing. (NASB)
Jas 1:12 Blessed is a man who perseveres under trial; for once he has been approved, he will receive the crown of life which the Lord has promised to those who love Him. (NASB)
Jas 1:13 Let no one say when he is tempted, "I am being tempted by God"; for God cannot be tempted by evil, and He Himself does not tempt anyone.
Jas 1:14 But each one is tempted when he is carried away and enticed by his own lust.
Jas 1:15 Then when lust has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and when sin is accomplished, it brings forth death.
Jas 1:16 Do not be deceived, my beloved brethren.
Jas 1:17 Every good thing given and every perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of lights, with whom there is no variation or shifting shadow. (NASB)
Jas 4:2 You lust and do not have; so you commit murder. You are envious and cannot obtain; so you fight and quarrel. You do not have because you do not ask.
Jas 4:3 You ask and do not receive, because you ask with wrong motives, so that you may spend it on your pleasures.
Jas 4:4 You adulteresses, do you not know that friendship with the world is hostility toward God? Therefore whoever wishes to be a friend of the world makes himself an enemy of God.
Jas 4:5 Or do you think that the Scripture speaks to no purpose: "He jealously desires the Spirit which He has made to dwell in us"?
Jas 4:6 But He gives a greater grace. Therefore it says, "GOD IS OPPOSED TO THE PROUD, BUT GIVES GRACE TO THE HUMBLE."
Jas 4:7 Submit therefore to God. Resist the devil and he will flee from you.
Jas 4:8 Draw near to God and He will draw near to you. Cleanse your hands, you sinners; and purify your hearts, you double-minded.
Jas 4:9 Be miserable and mourn and weep; let your laughter be turned into mourning and your joy to gloom.
Jas 4:10 Humble yourselves in the presence of the Lord, and He will exalt you. (NASB)
Jas 5:13 Is anyone among you suffering? Then he must pray. Is anyone cheerful? He is to sing praises.
Jas 5:14 Is anyone among you sick? Then he must call for the elders of the church and they are to pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord;
Jas 5:15 and the prayer offered in faith will restore the one who is sick, and the Lord will raise him up, and if he has committed sins, they will be forgiven him.
Jas 5:16 Therefore, confess your sins to one another, and pray for one another so that you may be healed. The effective prayer of a righteous man can accomplish much. (NASB)
I cried out to God to save me back in the 70s when I hit a bottom that left me desperate.
Several things happened that very moment that I still am in wonder about.
1. My craving for God's word exploded in my heart. (I could not get enough of His word)
2 Up till that time I had one of the filthiest mouths in the world and that was the one thing God took from me instantly. ((When I'm walking in sin, it returns fourfold)
3 My desires and world changed too.(Instantly I didn't want to watch or listen to the music or TV programing that was normally on. Instead I could not get enough sermons or God's word.)
4 Lust and sexual desires still showed up, though my heart started to fight against my flesh unlike before.
Jesus used scripture to fight against temptation and I don't know about you, but I can't think of a better way to fight against my temptations. Don't give up and run the race to win.
Virgil
Hi, It's my first time on these forums, so some introduction first. I'm UK-based, have been a Christian for 25 years or so, involved in church ministry of various kinds. To make a long story short, I discovered masturbation when I was about 15 or so and found a porn magazine on the ground on my way home from school. I bought a few magazines in my teenage years but nothing more. I have struggled with masturbation on and off ever since. I confessed it to my wife before we were married, and then had to confess to continuing to struggle with it a year or so after we married. I never mentioned it to her again. The major problem began when we got internet access, and one day I accidentally stumbled across a porn site. I looked and masturbated, felt disgusted with myself and vowed never to look again. I stayed away for a while – maybe even a few months – but of course came back. I fell into an established pattern of vowing never to look at porn again, holding out for weeks or months at a time (though I was still regularly masturbating in the meantime), then giving into temptation and spending hours on the net (always when I was alone in the house, and usually when my wife was away visiting her parents), looking at more and more explicit stuff each time I went on there, masturbating, and then feeling overwhelmed by shame and guilt afterwards. This continued on and off for probably around ten years or so. I don't think I thought I would ever overcome it – I just resigned myself to the fact that I would always live with this terrible secret. I also somehow convinced myself that I could be a Christian and lead this double life with impunity. How our sin blinds us. Anyway, my marriage was in tatters (though I refused to admit it), mainly because I had become so terribly selfish, prideful and emotionally withdrawn. Little did I know, but my wife had spoken to my pastor saying that she didn't know what was wrong with me and would he please meet up with me and do some digging. This was in February this year. Before he had chance to meet up with me, I searched the internet in desperation one day, came across the Setting Captives Free site and signed up for their 60-day Way of Purity course. My assigned mentor urged me to confess first to my pastor and then to my wife. I resisted strongly, but within days I confessed to my pastor and a couple of days later to my wife. I honestly believed that my wife was going to kick me out and my life as I knew it would end. And I knew this was what I deserved. To my amazement, my wife forgave me and showed me nothing but love and acceptance. She said she was just relieved to know what had been wrong all this time. I can only say that I experienced the grace of God in a way I had never previously thought possible. We spent some time with our pastor and his wife, and also with some other godly friends who were able to counsel us and pray with us. To say that our marriage has undergone a transformation this year would be a massive understatement. There has been an openness and honesty between us that wasn't even there when we first married. I can't begin to describe how wonderful it's been to no longer be living under a cloud of guilt and shame, and I am so thankful to God for His deliverance. Our sex life has also been unbelievable this year – I think for the first time in 17 years, sex has become a wonderful expression of love and sharing rather than a selfish act of self-gratification. I still have my struggles, and that's particularly what I want to ask for help on. A month or so ago, after months of purity (I confessed to my wife in February and had been pure since then), I suddenly found myself massively tempted to masturbate. It was a time when we had unable to make love for ten days or so (due to my wife's period, tiredness, etc.). To be honest, during the previous few months I hadn't really had much of a problem with temptation, and I thought I had the problem licked. But then temptation hit me like a steam train; I couldn't believe how overpoweringly strong it was and how weak I felt. My mind was awash with impure thoughts – images I had put out of my mind for months came flooding back. I couldn't sleep at night. I was even tempted to go back to looking at porn – after all the damage it had done to me and my family, it seems unbelievable to think that I came so close to returning to it. Thank God, I shared my struggles with my wife, and although she at first found it a little hard to deal with, she was ultimately very understanding and we were able to talk and pray together and I came through it without giving in. Since that time around a month and a half ago, I've had a couple of other periods where I've been beset with temptation. They tend to happen around the times of my wife's period or other times when she is perhaps tired and a little irritable, and I begin to feel emotionally rejected. I know she isn't rejecting me – at most it's a hormonal issue that she can't control – but it feels like rejection and I think that's one of the things that pushes me towards acting out. Again, I've managed to resist each time, but each time it's been an incredibly draining experience and I've felt pretty wiped out by it. My mentor at Setting Captives Free, who I've kept in touch with, says that it's normal to still struggle with temptation, and that though it may get easier over time, it's probably something we'll have to live with until we get to heaven. He's right, of course, and so I'm not asking so much about how to reduce temptation. What I'm really interested to know can be summed up in two questions: (1) How often do others of you recovering from sexual sin struggle with major temptation of this kind? (2) Does anyone have any suggested strategies as to how to resist when temptation strikes? I'm not really interested in elastic-band-on-the-wrist type techniques, which seem pretty shallow to me. Just looking for real advice from real guys who are walking or have walked this same journey. There is no way I ever want to go back to where I was, but lust is so incredibly powerful and at times I feel so weak and am honestly scared that I might give in at a weak moment. For info, I am committed to being accountable to a guy in my church (he's the guy from the couple I mentioned earlier who prayed with us). He's a fantastic guy, and we meet up and talk about how I'm doing from time to time and he has permission to ask me whatever he wants at any time. But it's not the type of relationship where I can phone him up all the time about my daily struggles. And I don't want to be that dependent on another person. There has to be a way that I can get sufficiently strong in my own faith and reliance on God that I can face this thing down and not come so close to the edge when faced with temptation. Thanks in advance for any advice.
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